Creation, Earth and the Environment
My pastor has been teaching on a series about Origins which dives into God’s creation, how we were created in His image, unleashing artistic expression, and understanding our true purpose on this earth.
I highly recommend you checkout the free podcast messages on our church’s website here:
http://churchatthegate.com/podcast.php
Here’s a summary of what this is all about:
“Origins: God’s Green Earth…
Every spring, God’s green earth comes alive! This was God’s promise to Noah… “as long as the earth endures, seedtime and harvest, cold and heat, summer and winter, day and night will never cease.” The verse also indicates this present earth won’t endure forever.Evidence abounds, our planet is fallen. Everything began with excellence at Creation, but the created order is on a path of degeneration. Eco‑gospel prophets like Al Gore are blowing the trumpet that we are in a planetary crisis—but, it’s confusing because their ideology is based on the belief that earth is evolving upward, from worse to better. (Evolution, mind you, isn’t a science; it’s a belief—a belief that actually runs counter to science and the evidence.)
Surprising some, science and Scripture agree about our origins. Once we understand our origins and God’s mandate that we steward creation in this age and the age to come, our identity and role in both come into focus.”
If you’ve been following Oprah Winfrey’s latest “New Earth” class with Eckhart Tolle, be careful. Her line of new age philosophy goes right along with Ted Turner’s population reduction agenda (reducing the earth’s population from 6 billion to 2 billion – a complete lie), and the pro-abortion (murder of pre-born babies) mandate.
The true life and health of this earth is found in the person of Jesus Christ, who is the Author and Creator of all things. He is full of eternal life, health, peace, joy, hope and love.
I’m not ashamed to stand up and proclaim Jesus Christ as Lord – and if you dig deep into the heart of God through His Word, you will see that our redemption is found through Him, not through new age philosophy of the earth, abortion, evolution or population control.
The first message in this series began on 3/30/08, and you can download the mp3 here:
http://churchatthegate.com/podcast/2008-03-30.mp3
If you’re looking for good, wholesome, life-giving teaching, you will be blessed by this series.
For excellent health,
Joe
Comments
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Good for you! I applaud you for standing up for your faith. I look forward to listening to this series of sermons. We live in interesting times don’t we? With Oprah. Obama, Gore, Turner, et al – it sure seems like the signs are all around us.
A brother in Texas.
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Thank you, Joe.
I pastor a small rural church in Oregon. I have been preaching about out state of government and how we are losing our freedoms little by little. I preached on abortion and how I sinned years ago by paying for one of daughters to get an abortion. And I am now about to embark on a series of sermons about creation.
I just finished reading a book by John MacArthur titled, The Truth War. And we are in a spiritual war. We Christians have to stand up for what the truth is and not be afraid. The Lord is by our sides.
Thank you for embarking on the spiritual war by coming out against people like Oprah, Al Gore and Ted Turner. These people are so untruthful. I had always felt that Oprah meant well, but some of the people that she has introduced into her realm of influence have influenced her to go in a different direction making things look like it is the right direction. And it is not. I have never liked Al Gore or Ted Turner when they speak. They have their own personal agenda. If they were to work with God through His Son, Jesus Christ, then I might listen to them.
All answers are found in the Holy Bible.
Thank you, thank you, thank you, Joe.
May the Lord be with you always.
Regards,
Pastor Don
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Joe
I appreciate your strong stance and agree with you whole-heartedly. I appreciate your not being ashamed to proclaim Jesus Christ as THE way, THE truth and THE life. Keep up the good work. -
Thanks for sharing the sermons from your pastor. By the way, your reflux remedy has worked great for me!! I went off the Nexium last August and have felt great since.
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It’s obvious that you have not seen any of Oprah/Eckhart’s A New Earth series. I have watched every one. At no time did she ever mention reducing the Earth’s population. Many times, she did refer to Jesus and how we can experience the Father thru Christ consciousness. Her philosophy will only deepen one’s faith in Jesus Christ, but only for those who don not have closed fundamentalist minds.
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It’s nice to hear the truth about evolution for a change. It is so rare in this culture that’s been bombarded with the Darwinist fairytale as fact.
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Good information.Thanks!!!
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I definitetly agree with you.Since I met Jesus-Christ,I prolaim Him as the only God ! He changed my life. He really is The way, The thruth, and The life !
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Joe:
Thanks for sharing. Your thoughts are right on track. What’s amazing is that the men that gave us science, Newton and many others, believed as you and I do. Back then evolution would have been laughable because they understood it to be the lie that it is, and because the evidence demands a Creator. -
Dear Joe,
I would just like to say how wonderful it is to find someone online taking care of peoples bodies that loves and serves the Lord!! Thankyou for this email. I was truly blessed knowing that you stand up for the Lord and His word.
It was something I needed to see today. What a blessing. I pray that today the Lord will open up to you great opportunity to share your faith and the call on your life to sincerely help people in spirit and in body. Thankyou for going out on a limb for the Lord.
Have a blessed day and thankyou for blessing mine. :o) -
I agree with all of the above.
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You have obviously not read The New Earth, or you really misunderstood it. I think you need to have accurate facts before attacking anyone. I don’t think it is the Christian way to “poison the well” for others. Oprah is Christian too & there is nothing in the book that conflicts with Christianity.
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Dear Joe,
When I signed in for your GERD & acid reflux help, little did I know, UNTIL NOW 🙂 that you are a lovely Christian, caring man, who, also, loves the Lord & has no problems telling the world about it! What a joy!I am a 59 yr. old grandma who has had her share of physcial & emotional problems. I’m sure the constant stress is why I have (along with GERD),Fibromyalgia, CFS, anxiety attacks & more. But, I,too, love the Lord with all my heart. And, I think we should remember what He said concerning when we read the Bible. We are to “believe as a little child.” Anyway, I remember this & that’s how I handle alot of the “stuff” going on today.
God bless you & your work,Joe. -
Just dropped in to see how this mad house was cooking. Hot in here ain’t it …and loud too!
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Joe Barton: Thank you for the help you have been to me. First with Gout treatment and then Rotator cuff torn problems following surgery.
But I was so pleased to hear your reference to Creation etc and the links to your church. i followed through on them out of curosity and i know i would be happy to join with you in SD, But Guelph Ontario (Outside of Toronto) is alittle far to commute.
This time I am interested in the ADHD article you just sent. My Grandson in the USA Michigan has it and many are telling my daughter to get him on Ritalin, But she is very hesitant to make the move. Now from you article I know why. I will forward it to her and at my expense get her to download your report.
Thanks for your help and May God continue to bless you for your testimony and boldness to make Him known.
Dave Findlay (former missionary to South America Ecuador with radio station HCJB) and pastor in Toronto.)
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Wow! a beliver that is not afraid to stand up for the Gospel online! Delightfully refreshing in this very PC handicapped society. I’m new to your site and have been passing your links around to my friends and family and will continue to do so even more now that I know that you are a Brother-in-Christ. I will be folowing your blogs on the environment carefully as I truly believe we are so totally arrogant to believe that we can do the damage that is contended by the global warming crowd. God IS in control and when he wants to warm things up, or cool things down, He will. With or without our interference or “help”. We are called to be “good stewards” of his creation and thus “users” of it! God looked on everything that he had created and said that it was good. Then he created Man to make use of what he had created. Then he sent his Son to save fallen man and help him while living in his creation.
Blessings Joe, to you and your family. -
Well said Joe! The moment we drift away from the absolutes of God’s Word we drown in the sea of the relative opinions of men and women, some of whom may be well-meaning, but deny the source of all knowledge, wisdom and life – Jesus Christ!
God bless and keep up the good work.
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I find it puzzling that in your concern for the world and its population you seem to ignore the fact that the latter is made up not just of Christians, but also Jews, Moslems (who, like you, believe in one god), Hindus, Buddhists, Shintoists, Daoists and members of myriad other faiths — even well meaning agnostics and atheists like me. How is it you espouse the healing traditions of so many of these other faiths but don’t appear to respect the faiths themselves?
It’s fine by me that you choose to worship the Christian trinity. You lose me when you insist that yours is the only way to go.
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What a pleasant surprise to see your testimony about creation. Praise God.
I wish all the people who rather listen to Oprah would spend an equal amount of time with your sermon series. That would only be fair.
Anybody for that challenge?
Keep up the good work, in the power of the Holy Spirit.
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Thank you for sharing your Christian faith with us.
Sometime after I signed up for your GERD information, I began to realize that you were a Christian man who really wants to help others with their health problems.
You are a such blessing to many. God bless you. -
Thank you for taking a stand. We are with you. The New Age religion is growing.
We are saddened to hear that Oprah used to be a Christian. We need to pray earnestly for her and many of her followers.
Ends days are here, it won’t be long until the trumpet sounds.
Keep looking up. -
“Evolution, mind you, isn’t a science; it’s a belief—a belief that actually runs counter to science and the evidence.”
What? Evolution IS indeed science and runs completely in line with facts, observations, evidence,etc. Pllease cite an actual sciencific source. Science is evidence based, evolutionary biology is evidenced based science. Joe, you clearly don’t know science. You make cure claims with NO evidence. This comment will be deleted I’m sure. -
DC – I’d encourage you to listen to my pastor’s sermon series to learn more about what he meant by “evolution is a belief” idea.
From my understanding, you have to have more faith as an evolutionist than you do as a creationist.
It takes much greater “faith” to believe in evolution – (that we supposedly evolved from monkeys, which evolved from tadpoles, which evolved from parasites, which evolved from a mutant form of a protein molecule, etc.).
Evolution has no reasonable, scientific (reproducible) explanation for the very beginning.
Big bang?
Big bang of what?
And how did that “what” get there?
That’s Faith.
From my perspective, it all comes down to simply looking at nature – the mountains, trees, plants, animals, stars, and the complexities of our human bodies – to realize that all of this is due to the awesome creative design abilities of God.
We are not here by random chance, after “millions of years”.
We are here by design.
We all have a purpose for our existence – we are not just random mutations, as evolution implies.
The earth exists as it is by design.
The intricacies of our bodies – blood vessels, organs, bone structures, fingernails, eyeballs, nose hairs, ear wax – is all part of God’s design.
That’s pretty exciting, and fulfilling.
I hope that any skeptics who read this blog will consider that God truly loves them, that He created them for a purpose, and that He wants them to enjoy the fellowship of their awesome Creator on a personal level.
Yes, it takes faith – but not as much faith as an evolutionist!
God bless,
Joe -
Big thanks to you Joe for not being timid with your faith.
Joe Barton is the real deal everyone. I know people online are suspect, but Joe is a real person, with a real family, he’s very active in our church and he’s helping thousands find healing and a better life through natual remedies. And, he knows there is no lasting healing apart from Jesus – he came to give us life abundant!
Joe – thanks for pointing people to my ORIGINS: GOD’S GREEN EARTH message series. We are called not only to steward our bodies but the rest of creation as well. God’s people have dropped the ball there and the world has picked up this message now in a very misguided way. Everyone is debating whether its getting hotter or colder while the real undercurrent is a population control agenda of ridding the world of all these people. What I see is the Adversary getting “mom and dad” fussing about the thermostat – too hot or too cold – all the while he takes the children.
Right now I’m just starting a good book on this subject – Fatal Misconception: The Struggle to Control World Population by Matthew Connelly. He sees a biological totalitarianism rising globally.
Here’s a link to a youtube video for those who think what Oprah is espousing is in any way compatable with Biblical Christianity. http://midnightcry.wordpress.com/2008/04/03/caution/
Here’s a link for those wondering how I can say evolution is a far cry from anything like science. http://stevehickey.wordpress.com/2008/04/23/killing-people-to-save-the-planet-part-two/
Blessings to you all!
Pastor Steve Hickey, Church at the Gate
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Joe,
Creationism is not simply not science (“which deals with how nature works”), its theology (deals withthe ‘why’ of it all). They are mutually exclusive domains of human knowledge and insight.If you somehow ‘disproved evolution’ it would not make creationism suddenly correct, since it is a supernatural explanation and has no science to back it up, instead you likely would have distilled a new and more refined theory of evolution. Evolutionary science has done very thing this for 150 years. It has gotten stronger and more predictive at each step. The questions are now in the details and not the overarching theory itself.
“It takes much greater “faith” to believe in evolution -”
Actually I disagree it requires acceptance of facts and understandable natural processes (not always easy to grasp but understanable and observable with reasonabe effort.)
Faith and belief are religious and theological requirements.Here is a link to MIT’s new outstanding online high school AP Biology course:
http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/hs/biology/biology/index.htm
You can click on the evolution chapters for an overview.“(that we supposedly evolved from monkeys, which evolved from tadpoles, which evolved from parasites, which evolved from a mutant form of a protein molecule, etc.)”
Simply too mixed up a summation to even be wrong.There is, in fact, ample support for the theory of evolution. It has withstood every scientic challange and is the best supported core theory. By the way, humans are not ‘evolved from monkees’, we just have a common ancestor (the evidence is actually in your DNA).
“Evolution has no reasonable, scientific (reproducible) explanation for the very beginning.”
Evolution does not specfically deal with the ‘origins of life’ and instead is specifically about the changes in species over time.“Big bang?”
Evolutionary Theory has absolutely nothing to do with the Big Bang theory or the ‘origins of the universe’, that would be another branch of science: astrophysics, astronomy and cosmology.DC
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Good for you, Joe. I admire your strong view on Jesus and willingness to offend others to proclaim the truth. I hope this encourages others to stand up and be counted.
Jack
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DC:
I invite you to put aside what you have been taught for a minute and consider some real facts without prejudice:Many of the greatest scientists that ever lived disagree with you. Newton, Kepler, Boyle, Einstein, to name a few. How is it that most of the men that gave us “science” believed in a Creator? In addition, thousands of present day scientists with Ph.D’s from secular universities believe there has to be a Creator as well.
“It takes much greater “faith” to believe in evolution -”
Actually I disagree it requires acceptance of facts and understandable natural processes.”DC – where are all the “facts” you speak of? What about the real fact that we should be able to find thousands and thousands of transitional fossils if evolution has been taking place for millons of years. They don’t exist.
And what about mutations. Most by far have a negative or neutral effect. The few beneficial ones you could name are specific to a particular environment, but even so, do those tiny examples provide evidence for molecules to man evolution? That requires a massive increase in information.
And what about the Second Law of Thermodynamics… that everything is going from a state of order to disorder, running down. That’s what we are taught in school and that’s what the evidence shows us. But evolution requires just the opposite, a massive increase in information for which we don’t have evidence.
What about radiometric dating? Rocks from the Mt. St. Helens volcano in 1980 test 1 million years old. Carbon 14 with a half-life of about 5000 years found in diamonds that are supposedly millions of years old? To some, this is the holy grail of evolution, but you can’t trust it. (There are many other examples.)“Evolution does not specfically deal with the ‘origins of life’ and instead is specifically about the changes in species over time.”
That depends on which definition of evolution you use.I invite you to check out http://www.answersingenesis.org, an information packed website that is monitored by Ph.D creation scientists. Here’s some information from that site:
“The ‘General Theory of Evolution’ (GTE) was defined by the evolutionist Kerkut as ‘the theory that all the living forms in the world have arisen from a single source which itself came from an inorganic form.’ This is what creationists oppose, the idea that particles turned into people over time, without any need for an intelligent designer.
Many many evolutionary propagandists are guilty of the deceitful practice of equivocation, that is, switching the meaning of a single word (evolution) part-way through an argument. A common tactic is simply to produce examples of change over time, call this ‘evolution’, then imply that the GTE is thereby proven or even essential, and Creation disproven.”So this GTE theory does include origins.
Bottom line, DC, evolution is not really “science” after all. True Science requires a theory to be reproducable/testable and you can’t reproduce evolution nor creation, so they both require faith. But we can look at the evidence and the evidence demands a Creator. In addition, evolution offers no hope for eternity. Since there is a Creator, we can have hope through the promises of the Creator himself, Jesus Christ. I invite you to read the Bible, and start questioning the propoganda that is called science today.
Sincerely,
Steve Huedepohl
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Praise the Lord! Stand up for rights to the one and only triune God!!
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Steve and Joe,
Hey I read the bible and went to both Catholic and public schools growing up (hint: Catholic High Schools teach real science, theology is another class and never is mixed up). You seem to think I’m an atheist, I’m actually a Catholic.Your knowledge of science is very minimal. Simply go to the MIT link I provided (Massachsetts Institute of Technolgy, now your going to tell me they don’t know science?).
There is ample testable evidence, your just unaware of it or unwilling to look. Its in your very DNA (look up Moleclar Biology).“But we can look at the evidence and the evidence demands a Creator.” Please indentify the testable theory of creationism? Which of the mutually exclusive theories do you support: Young Earth Creationism , Old Earth Creationism, ID, Theistic Ccreationism? If one is correct the others have to be wrong. So which is it?
How do you test your theory?This is fun.
DC -
Guys,
Please identify the non-religous institutions of higher learning that teach creationism as science. All I find are bible colleges like Bob Jone U. teaching creationism.First would you have agree that these places teach real science real science since the technology that you rely on every day comes from these places. The airliners, phones, cars, medical services, chemicals, luiquid fuels, pharmacueticals, and computers you are around every day are based on the same science that supports evolutionary science.
Here a few exmaples that are able to attract the most talented people in the world as students, teachers, and reseachers. Go to their websites and click into the science courses and look at biology.
MIT
CalTech California Institute of Technolgy
Stanford
Yale
Harvard
RPI
Columbia
Johns-Hopkins
Carniegie-Mellon
Princeton
Notre-Dame
DukeNO ONE OF THESE teaches anything from creationists because it not science.
So you are saying that they have totally missed it on Biology, Life Sciences, Genetics, Bioenginnering, Pharmacology, but somehow at the same time do just with Inorganic and Organic Chemistry, Physics, Geology, Geophysics, Medicine, Math, Enginnering. etc.
So by some clever trick a group of ‘evolution propagandists’ have fooled the entire scientific community for over 100 years with no evidence. Dream on.Regards,
DC -
DC:
Nice side-step, but what about the facts!Surely you don’t believe that the Wright Brothers had to believe in evolution to invent the powered airplane! In fact, none of the real science that has lead to all of the technological advances in the 20th century required a belief in evolution. That’s a fact.
Promoting a belief in evolution is more about pushing a particular world view than it is science, i.e. a world view without God.
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DC – if you are a Catholic, then by definition you must believe in the God that Roman Catholicism teaches about.
Is that true?
If you believe in God, you must also believe that the Scriptures are God’s inspired Word – that it is infallible, without error. (And, as a former Catholic myself, I understand that the interpretation of the Scriptures relies on the interpretation of the Catholic Church.)
Is that true?
If you believe the Bible/Church combo is infallible, then you must believe that the book of Genesis is God’s inspired revelation of how He created the earth, and everything in it.
Is that true?
And, if you believe that the book of Genesis is inspired by God and not a fairy tale, then you must believe that Adam and Eve were created no more than 7,000 years ago – since there is a detailed genealogy from Adam to Christ.
The Catechism of the Catholic Church goes into detail of God’s Creation in sections 279 through 301 – and, I didn’t read any anything other than Creation as the official Catholic explanation of the origin of this earth and everything in it.
So… what am I missing?
Are you truly a “good” Catholic?
~ Joe
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Joe,
“If you believe in God, you must also believe that the Scriptures are God’s inspired Word – that it is infallible, without error.” OK, why? Very few Cathlolics follow all the teachings of the church. The church ACTUALLY teaches evolution and geology at its high schools and colleges.
I would not look at a science book to figure out God and spiritual matters, why would I use one of the various versions of the Bible to understand out science and natural processes of the universe? I can live with the reality that the bible is not any good for science.So you are now saying the earth is 7,000 years old? Which is basically called ‘Young Earth Creationism.’
How do you know?
So you reject Theistic Creationism, Old Earth Creationism, and ‘ID’ since they can’t be true if ‘Young Earth’ is true.If that is what you belive is true, then another entire branch of science related to Geology is also wrong since that is all based on a 4.5 billion-year-old earth. Now you have to ‘disprove’ all the supporting geophysics for your 7,000 year old earth. That includes geochemistry, geomorphology, petrology, etc. Are you saying that all the geologists have also missed the ‘fact’ that the earth is only 7,000 years old? How come you are not complaining about those ‘progandizing geologists’?
So if the earth is only 7000 years old, for example, exactly where did all the coal and oil (not called ‘fossil fuels’ for nothing) come from if the reproducable processes that make it require ancient oceans depositing layers of playnkton or plants on land to be slowly buried and subjeted to immemse pressures and heat in precise combinations for hundreds of millions of years? So we have to junk all that geo-science as well?
That also means ‘Radiometric Dating’ is false since it dates the earth and is turn is based on the observable decay of isotopes to date ancient materials. That puts Atomic Physics on shakey ground now as well since Radiomateric dating comes from atomic physics.
The Catholic Church made peace with science along time ago and lives with the theory of evolution with the provision that god ‘creates the soul’ and that the body ‘may have’ evolved from earlier forms.
Enjoying this,
DC -
DC,
A true Catholic in good standing is someone who follows all the teachings of the church, not just those that you want to follow. It’s not a smorgasbord.
And, it’s true the pope did make some concessions to the evolution argument – but I see that as another flaw of the Catholic Church!
I think what it all comes down to is our difference in fundamental presuppositions.
I believe in the inerrancy and infallibility of the Scriptures. You believe in science.
Here’s a good article I’ll point you to, to explain why I say that:
http://answersingenesis.org/docs/1866.asp
Here’s the key quote from that article:
“Question: Why would any Christian want to take man’s fallible dating methods and use them to impose an idea on the infallible Word of God? Christians who accept billions of years are in essence saying that man’s word is infallible, but God’s Word is fallible!”
Again, my world view affirms that we are not here by random chance – we are not mistakes – we are here for a reason, and we have an infinitely unsearchable Creator who loves us and wants us to give thanks to Him for the beauty of His amazing creation.
Just like when I see a beautiful painting and think, “Wow! The guy who painted that is amazing!”… when I see a rainbow, or a majestic mountain, a lunar eclipse, or a beautiful sunset, I think “Wow! God is amazing!”.
And again, as Steve pointed out earlier, how do you deal with scientists dating the 1980 Mt. St. Helens eruption as being 1 million years old?
Science is not infallible.
~ Joe
p.s. Do you believe God created anything? If so, what?
Then I will ask you “If God could create something out of nothing, why couldn’t God create something that appears “old” – even though it’s brand new?”
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Joe,
Yes I’m saying that the bible is not a reliable source for science.
“I believe in the inerrancy and infallibility of the Scriptures. You believe in science.”
“Promoting a belief in evolution is more about pushing a particular world view than it is science, i.e. a world view without God.”
Science says nothing about religion and never brings up God.
It gets confused with a ‘world view’ when it gets placed in the religion section due to the ToE touching on man. Its not a ‘world view’ it is a methodolgy to unwind and understand the natural universe. There is nothing about living a good life, the meaning of life, etc.The difference is I do not say religion is wrong to belive in. Conversely fundemetalists continue to attempt to undermine science and science education in many places in the US. (Example the Dover, PA case, they lost).
Last week in Florida a significant number of polticians spent many hours attempting undermine the teaching of science in FL public high schools. They cannot push religion in directly so they want to systematically weaken the teaching of science and wedges in weak creationist teachings that way. In Kansas several years ago the state education board they actually modified the very definition of ‘science’ to include ‘supernatural’ explanations as a way to wedge in creationism.So you see Joe I don’t suggest you teach science in sunday school, but many of your fellow bible fundamentalists want to teach creationism in the public schools. That is where the line is crossed.
Regards,
DC -
DC:
In response to comments you made to Joe:So you are now saying the earth is 7,000 years old? Which is basically called ‘Young Earth Creationism.’
How do you know?
So you reject Theistic Creationism, Old Earth Creationism, and ‘ID’ since they can’t be true if ‘Young Earth’ is true.If you are going to state these terms, I suggest you learn the proper names and meanings. By “Theistic Creationism”, I assume you really mean Theistic Evolution. Theistic Creationism is a redundant term, since creationists already believe that God created the universe and all living things. Theistic evolution would say that God used evolution to create everything. So, when it comes to creationism, there are only 2 categories, young-earth and old-earth (Theistic Evolution)
I am a young-earth creationist as is Joe. If you had any idea of what young earth creationism is about, you would know that the worldwide flood of Noah can account for most all of the geology we see on the earth today, far better that uniformitarianism or gradualism. I suggest Henry M. Morris’ book “The Genesis Flood”. When we find fossils completely in tact, like they were fossilized even while moving, we know that they couldn’t have fossilized over a long time span. But Noah’s flood (taught by the Bible) would explain that perfectly. That’s why evolutionists are always changing their definitions, because they can’t account for the evidence we see.
DC, are you aware that the Mt. St. Helens eruption in 1980 produced a 1/40 scale “Grand Canyon” in less than a week, complete with sedimentary layers and a petrified forest submerged in the lake downstream! It doesn’t take millions of years to create the geology we see on the earth today.
Regarding radiometric dating, there are very wide variations of dates for a given sample… millions of years wide. As you may know, when a sample is sent to a dating lab, the person sending it is asked how old they think it is. If it comes back out of range for what it “should” be, the date is rejected. You’re welcome to check out the Institute for Creation Research’s website at icr.org. They recently finished a 5-year “RATE” study to analyze dating methods. They discovered some very interesting facts that prove the inaccuracies of radiometric dating… like diamonds from deep in the earth supposed millions of year old that contain Carbon 14 with a half-life of around 5000 years.
DC, by your closing comments, it appears that this is a game to you. But the teaching of evolution and the conclusions that go with it are serious. The moral decay in this country can be tracked side by side with the expulsion of God from the classroom. The extensions of evolution are obvious: abortion, euthanasia, moral decay, etc., because man is reduced to an “accident” of nature, and because the standards that this country were built on, namely the Bible, don’t count any more.
As you may know, most scientists in the world today are atheists, and therefore evolutionists. Read what their picture of the world is. It’s hopelessness, and they admit it! That’s not very inviting to me.
Finally, in your heart of hearts, do you honestly believe that the intricacies of the human body and of life in general, could be accounted for by a series of accidents over millions of years, with no intelligent design? If so, you have greater faith than I do!
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DC:
Please forgive me for being sarcastic in that last post.Actually, I used to think like you do. I am a mechanical engineer and when I became a Chrisian in 1983, I started reading about creation science. It was brand new to me, but it made a lot of sense. I have been a student all these years and I can tell you that it still makes sense.
I encourage you again to check out http://www.answersingensis.org or icr.org. They have tons of material available. BTW, both the Institute for Creation Research and Answers in Genesis have Ph.D scientists on staff that were schooled at secular universities and that are creationists.
Blessings,
Steve Huedepohl
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DC and Steve – thank you both for your comments and willingness to discuss these issues in a civilized manner.
http://www.AnswersInGenesis.org is an excellent website that covers all sorts of FAQ’s – I hope one or two evolutionists who read this blog will spend some serious time considering creationism with an open mind.
May God bless you with hope!
~ Joe
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I really do appreciate you speaking up for Jesus and yes he does fullfill that emptiness that so many people dont have, thats why we have this problem to begin with.Most people argue and have nothing to base their argument on because they havent even read the Bible.I pray that God removes that veil of darkness from their eyes and gives them the wisdom to understand what Jesus really did for us. May God Bless you Joe
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Hello Joe,
Sorry i ignored most of your e-mails.
Found your site, very interesting, and enlightening.
I have said to many for years, evolutionism is a religion.
As one who believe’s in The Living Word of God, and converse’s, with him daily through his Living Rhema, Appreciate your blog, site, am not to computer savvy, but as one of the ancient one’s, I started using the pc in my seventy’s, and that was quite a few years agoWill be watching for your health post, and will give them more of my attention.
Great site, great information, appreciate the pro and con arguments, publishing Gods Words, Thoughts, Truth is a win, win situation.
The Word is as proclaimed, the infalliable seed of the Word,
Clear enough to me and to you I’am sure, and to millions and millions of those who had the Damascus Road experience are encounter with The Eternal Living, Word of God, are the Eternal Rhema.Know God, Know Peace,
No God, No Peace.Shalom
Blessings to you and yours, from the Prince and Author of all things. -
Thanks everyone. I actually have spent time at answersingenisus and the related sources. I do not view this as game, instead I find it very interesting to understand thought processes of others. I find the linkage of ‘evolutionist’ to ‘atheist’ to be an illogical since its a science that is no different from chemistry, geology, or astronomy.
This is the stretch is what I find to be frankly disturbing. Evolutionary Biology and science have nothing to do with all of this human failings listed below. It is simply describing the world around us. The ‘fact’ of E=MC2 does not change because people used the facts uncovered by early 20th century physics to construct atomic bonds in 1945 and kill two cities filled with God;s children. It was simply true before they figured out the puzzle.
“But the teaching of evolution and the conclusions that go with it are serious. The moral decay in this country can be tracked side by side with the expulsion of God from the classroom. The extensions of evolution are obvious: abortion, euthanasia, moral decay, etc., because man is reduced to an “accident” of nature, and because the standards that this country were built on, namely the Bible, don’t count any more.”
I cannot see how the facts of how natural system processes work have bearing or standing in issues like ‘moral decay.’
Abortion predates evolutionary science by thousands of years and is practiced by many societies and cultures irrespective of science.
All of those things mentioned are human actions that predate the founding of the US and the development of science 300 years ago. The US is amoung the most religious countries in the world.I know I will never convince you of anything using science. faith is faith and science is science.
take care all
DC -
Concerning the ample evidence at MIT, seeing that your knowledge of science is not “minimal” like Steve’s, please save us time and provide 3 indisputable fossil examples that prove cross-generation of species. BTW, I seriously doubt any serious, informed scientist would argue that Isaac Newton’s, Robert Boyle’s, Johannes Kepler’s, and Albert Einstein’s knowledge of science was “minimal”. All of these scientists held a creationists view at a time when evolution as an “Origin” of life was and had been espoused as an explanation. Obviously you can not use the Archaeoraptor example as one (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/1248079.stm), but I do have a question concerning this hoax.
If in fact as you say, MIT provides “ample testable evidence” that proves Evolution, and it is purported that the fossil evidence backs this claim up, then why did the National Geographic Society herald the Archaeoraptor discovery as “the missing link” between birds and dinosaurs? Surely the link couldn’t be “missing” if previous examples existed, and wouldn’t one believe that with the millions of fossils already categorized by science, that hundreds of thousands of examples if not just thousands exist that have already proven the link?
This example does however show one undeniable truth. Evolutionists are so desperate to find “the missing link” that they are willing to forego good, dependable, accurate scientific analysis in an attempt to prove their hypothesis and to censure opposing thought!
Sincerely,
Rodney
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Rodney,
Welcome to our discussion, its fun to kick this stuff around.
OK I’ll bite.
Newton died in 1727.
Boyle passed away in 1691.
Darwin was born in 1809, and passed away in 1889.
These first two fellow never heard about Darwin’s theories and were pioneers in physics, chemistry, and math. They did not do anything with biology from what have seen and have nothing to add. Why are they relevant?Einstein came latter and was not a Christian-type creationist (he was a Jew), and certianly would not place the age of the earth at 7,000 years. His big brain theories led to the Big Bang theory that puts the age of the universe at 10 billion years and puts the earth at 3.5 to 4.5 billion. I’ve never seen anything about him regarding the ToE. There a bunch of ‘God’ related quotes from Dr. E. if that is what you mean to get at. Dr. E seems to lean towards a more general pan-theistic god concept.
“I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it.” (Albert Einstein, 1954)
“I believe in Spinoza’s God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings.” (Albert Einstein)
The ToE does not reference any God or depend upon supernatural forces, or get into the actual origins of life. It just explains the changes in species over time through a natural process. If the ToE is ever ‘disproved’ it will be replaced by another larger concept of natural processes. Einstein gravity replaced Newton’s by over arching them in something bigger.
I will not waste time on fossils and ‘missimg link’ wac-a-mole stuff. That seems pointless; there is plenty of fossil evidence (a few frauds along the way) of numerous long extinct species stting in ancient rocks that formed way back. In the intact strata the progression of species is clear. You don’t find modern rabbits in the company of dinosours that got wiped out 65 million years ago. The funny logic exercise is that everytime a new fossil is found that fills and fitted in, a ‘missing link’ it creates two new ‘missing link’ holes to fill.
Relatively few individuals end up as fossils and few of those get found by a modern human, so the sample will always be a fraction of the original cast of characters.
You have a much larger ‘problem’ for you guys emerging over in the genomic research department. There the DNA record that show the links between both living species and past species using portions of inactive DNA called pusedogenes. Essentially, because they are inactive over very long periods they get carried foward without changes and get passed down through the evolutionary process. The degree of similarity between pseudogenes among species reflects their evolutionary relatedness. The wonder of this is that as mores species genes are sequenced the relationships will mutiple and reinforce the ToE. There is an interesting article in the current Scientific American about this topic.
Have a look:
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=junk-rna-may-have-playedIts a whole science called ‘molecular biology’ does this part and then gets into all that genome stuff and has medical applications. Its really just getting started and will be generating a ton of new insights into the power of genetics. The National Academy of Sciences as stuff on their websites and publications for those interested.
I don’t for a momment mean to disparage other people’s faiths.
In my son’s school the #1 student in 8th grade advanced physcial science is interesting, he scores very high on biology, chemistry, and physics and says he is also a creationist, but does not worry about biological science ruining his strong faith. My son sits with this guy every day in science lab. (The school is rank 1st in the state amoung prep schools for science in junior and senior high and sends a small group of graduates to MIT, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, and Harvard in sciences every year – that is why people pay to send their kids there.)take care
DC -
Joe, I like your post much. A good reminder of life and being. We are from wilderness but buried into the modern world. Slow down is the way I go, everthing is just moving too fast.
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Hi Joe,
I share your comments on creation vis-a-vis evolution. The evolutionary fable, rooted in the Spontaneous Generation hypothesis of a bygone era, is NOT competing with creation per se as an explanation of origins.Absurd though this may sound, my research reckons evolution is solely about the need to revise history. Which raises the obvious:- What is there to hide by altering history? Let me tell ya….a lot.
Friend, Jack
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I am glad you are happy in your religion Joe. I like to keep an open mind and listen to everything being offered. I do like Oprah but I am a intelligent being and can truly make up my own mind whether or not I want to follow anything that is put forth on the show.
I would never question your religious beliefs but they are not for me, I will choose my own way.
I love your post. Please consider warning fellow americans and christians of the new world orders plan for martial law in our country. We are poised to attack Iran and people need to be aware. If not aware, check out steve quayles website. The North American Union, The Amero…our shared money with mexico and canada. Try fema camps united states. Time is short. God Bless, Ann